Well, Tony P. already asked for it–and to be honest, I thought about putting it up, but my thoughts on the matter are fairly straight forward, and I wasn’t sure it was worth the post.
Plus, it’s come up before, here and here (and before we go all cynical on Tony P. for saying yes in one place, no in another, I believe the no is in reference to him being a first year guy).
But now ProFootballTalk.com has posted the question, and since we do seem to talk a lot about the Hall of Fame here, I figured we better do it here too–especially since frankly I think we’ve got a better group of Hall of Fame minds discussing Hall of Fame matters.
So the question is–is Steve McNair worthy of the Pro Footabll Hall of Fame?
If my math is right, he’ll be eligible in 2013–the same year as Michael Strahan, Warren Sapp, Jonathon Ogden, Larry Allen and more.
McNair’s stats include 31,300 yards, 174 TDs vs. 119 Ints, 82.8 career rating, 60.1% completion percentage, and 37 rushing TDs. He appeared in one Super Bowl, was a 3-time Pro Bowler, was not ever a 1st team All-Pro, and won one co-MVP in 2003.
Non-tangibles that may come into play, whether they should or not, would be his reputation as a gritty player who would play through pain, although he also did miss a lot of games (at least 28 after becoming the full time starter, by my count), the fact that he was the first highly drafted black QB from a smaller, traditionally black school, who had a team built around him (there were teams that had been built around black QBs before [Warren Moon], and black QBs drafted in the first round [Doug Williams], but none that were drafted as high as #3).
Information forthcoming around the circumstances of his murder could also be on the minds of some voters. Like I said, these are non-tangibles that probably shouldn’t be considered, but the voters, although members of the media, are also (mostly) human.
So what say you, OUR voting members? Leave your rationale in the comments below…
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Did I really say yes and no for McNair for the HOF. :) Hmm. Now as I ponder the question again the answer seems as unclear as before.
Steve was always an easy guy to root for because of his storyline which usually include a broken bone or something torn. Injury was a bigger part of his career than most. I actually think his injuries took away from the fact he was one of the most physically gifted players to ever suit up at QB. The fact he lasted as long as he did running the ball in a league that eats up QB’s was remarkable.
The question is “Did Steve McNair do enough from the QB position to be a regarded a HOF QB.”? It’s not what kind of teammate was he or how much was he loved by his fans or how much his opponents respected him. Which by all accounts he was a tremendous competitor and person. It’s when you look McNair’s statistics and accomplishments do the measure up to other HOF QB’s?
I really don’t know!! He had an ability to throw and run which made him extremely dangerous. IMO he wasn’t as good as Steve Young but is very comparable to Donavan McNabb. If you think McNabb is a HOFer if he quit today than there’s a serious argument for McNair too. So no he’s not a first ballot guy but time will tell. We’ll have to see how the QB talent shakes out over a generation. He might end up in the top five. We already know who one and two are. :)
I personally have zero problem if Steve McNair is inducted into the HOF. He was a rare talent coming into the league and was a treat to watch for many years. He lifted a franchise to a level they had never been before. My only wish is that we could of seen him do it in Houston.
I wish his family God’s peace through this difficult time.
Steve, R.I.P.
I agree with you Tony. I don’t know if he is a HOFer or not. Remember, he is 1 of 3 QB’s to pass for 30,000 yards and rush for 3,000 yards. The others are in the HOF. If he won the SB, he probably would have been MVP. he has a league MVP and he played hurt.
D-Nabb is a HOF already?!
D-Nabb will join the 30,000 yd / 3,000 yd club this year barring injury. If he finishes out his career well he’ll undoubtedly be the one to hurt McNair’s HOF chances IMO.
From the early 40’s to late 50’s you have a group of 6 HOF QB’s in: Waterfied, Graham, Layne, Tittle, Van Brocklin, and Blanda (played 26 years!!!).
From the mid-50’s to early 70’s you have group of 6 HOF QB’s in: Unitas, Starr, Jurgensen, Tarkington, Namath, and Dawson in the HOF. Unfortunately they’re probably done with Brodie, Hadl and Gabriel left in the cold!! Since the group includes players from two leagues there’s justification for the addition of one more player to the HOF IMO. If I had one pick I’m taking Brodie because of his late career success in the Playoffs.
From the late 60’s to early 80’s we only have 5 HOF QB’s in: Staubach, Griese, Bradshaw, Tarkington, and Fouts. I think they should two more to the HOF from Anderson, Stabler and Plunkett. I would suggest picking Anderson because of his terrific passing accuracy and leadership ability in leading Cinncy to a close defeat to young Joe Montana and the 49ers in the 1981 Super Bowl. Two-time Super Bowl winning QB Plunkett is my other pick.
From the early 80’s to late 90’s you have 7 HOF QB’s in Montana, Moon, Marino, Elway, Kelly, Aikman, and Young. Four of the seven won Super Bowls and only one didn’t reach the big game. You also have strong candidates in Esiason and Simms.
So it kind of looks like 7-8 is a good range of HOF QB’s moving forward based on the Voters past selections for any given generation. No reason to think the amount of talent will drastically improve moving forward for a very difficult position.
Looking at today crop from the mid-90’s to about 2013 we can assume we already have 3 of our QB HOFers in: Favre, Manning, Brady and McNabb. Than IMO Warner and Roethlisberger are about shoe ins with a couple good years left to play.That’s a fairly solid six HOF QB’s. IMO,that leaves 2 or possibly 3 (if you’re cold to Warner) HOFers left to pick from this time frame.
The guys who are moving in HOF direction are: Rivers, Cutler, Romo, Brees and possibly Palmer. All will likely have great numbers but need to win big along the way. Plus there are few retired QBs to pay attention to but unlikely choices in: Drew Bledsoe, Rich Gannon, and a very simuliar QB in style and statistics in Randall Cunningham. Lastly we have McNair’s career which looms solid as a rock but far from a shoe in for the HOF. Any other QB starting out would be in the next group of great QBs.
When you break it down like this it makes McNair’s HOF induction very remote IMO!! It’s clear with three more years before possible election that McNair supporters will have to endure several waves of comparison before a decision is made. His career will almost certianly be compared in relative terms to Cunningham, Brees, Rivers, Romo, Cutler, and possibly Palmer for one or two remaining positions. I like Warner to make it as the last pick years down the road and also like Rivers’ chances. I think Brees will smash lots od passing records and think he has a good shot. I think Cunningham’s and McNair’s career’s basically cancel one another out.
IMO, if there are 7 clear choices for HOF QB, the Voters will not vote McNair into the HOF unless……. the intangible happens.
The intangible for McNair is you just don’t know how the voters will feel about his tradject death circumstances. I think he’ll be remember as a more sympathetic character with the passage of time. With LB Derrick Thomas they didn’t rush his induction because IMO it was like they wanted to move on to other selections before him and they saw no hurry. Everyone (except family) kind of had a comfort in knowing he would make it in time. With Steve we don’t know anything. There’s a slim chance and I believe really the only chance (unless all of the potential players career’s collapse which isn’t likely) that the Voters choose to be decisive and move with a powerful feeling of wanting to do something positive for his four boys and the rest of the family by selecting him First ballot. I personally hope they select him in the first year if they are going to. He’s a marginal pick IMO and that’s the best way to go. I’ll give him a 5% chance of reaching the HOF that way.
And in my not so expert opinion my FINAL ANSWER IS NO, he’s not a HOFer to me!!! He goes to the Hall of Very Good with many other fine players.
Hey Brad. Since I got called out by Tony on my McNair flip-flop, how about your HOF QB guidelines. Lol!!! Just kidding you but this is what you stated as your QB guideline for HOF consideration:
QB: 1/5, 35,000 passing yards, 205 TD’s and .600 record as a starter. Leading the NFL in a passing stat for the season.
I think McNair fell short on all criteria. You didn’t include rushing yards. :) I guess we both need to work on our analysis. Lol!! :)
Tony, I fear McNair isn’t my only inconsistency. Hahaha!! I’ll try to do better. I’m always learning new info and forming new opinions. This opinion on McNair is final. :) I reversed a while back on Johnny Robinson of the AFL. Even more since corresponding with his cousin. I found out he was a much better athlete than I knew before. Also I was leaning no because the AFL is such an up hill battle. Not a good reason but is kind of discouraging. In addition I rarely saw most of them play. Everyone should check out the revised AFL HOF website.
http://www.remembertheafl.com/AFLHallOfFame.htm
I’m convinced now that there are many more great players who are deserving of the NFL HOF. I need to find out from Johnny when he honestly believes most of the teams of the AFL were on a par with NFL. I was of the belief that it happened really late in the 60’s, before the league had good talent throughout. If you have a player that thrived from 1960-65 and all his stats were from playing patsies we should know before considering promoting him as HOF caliber.
This is a quote from the Pro-Football Reference Website:
“I’m a country guy from Mississippi who keeps it simple.” – Steve McNair
Tony P, you are calling Tony Romo a potential HOFer? He is 28, and has only played 3 seasons as a starter. Palmer needs an O-Line or no HOF IMO. Favre, Manning, Brady, and Warner, Brees, and McNabb(there I said it!) are the HOFers of today, 00’s . Derrick Thomas was on the All-Decade Team. He was a 2/9. The voters didn’t factor in his death IMO. He was a HOFer as is. Lol on calling me out on my “HOF” guidelines. And Tony P, the reason why McNair didn’t AP in his MVP season is because Manning was co-MVP with him and he AP.
Tony P – No worries on flip flopping–I do it all the time (plus, I still think you may have said that yes he was, but that he wasn’t a first ballot guy).
I noticed the “country guy from Mississippi” quote on the Pro-Football Reference site as well–not sure how the way he apparently died is the life of a guy keeping it simple…
As for McNabb–I find it interesting that half of his team’s own fans probably would disagree with the idea that he is a HOFer. Not that that counts for anything, but I always find that dynamic interesting.
I included the McNair quote because it was ironic and a bit thought provoking. It looks like he left his life’s path.
I tried to list the QB’s who have shown the potential to put up big numbers over a few year period. Romo is certianly on a path to be a HOFer with a half a dozen more very good years and some big wins (that’s key!). Roger Staubach didn’t play much until he was 29 years old and didn’t play a full season until he was 31 years old. I think Romo’s been beaten up so much my the media that we don’t realize how great he’s performed in 3 years. Two time PB and like out how great his numbers are.
Palmer is probably more of a stretch because of his injury and failure to regain his form due to various reasons.
I knew that McNair didn’t AP because of Manning. That’s why it’s unlikely to happen again. Normally they can pick one guy over the other, especially at the same position.